Bush noble?

micadelic said:

I have had many problems with Mr. Bush but one thing I have always believed about him, his motives are noble, at least to him. You may disagree but he’s not out to fuck anybodies children dood.

Bush noble? You really believe that? Even prior to being President he has proved himself to be an inept opportunist. As President his leadership has been abysmal. He has shut out voices of opposition and ignored the insights of 50% of this country not to mention scientists such as the Surgeon General.

He is out to fuck the children. In his mind he calls it fancy words like “capitalism” and “free markets” but he knows, and you know, that the private sector will not do the right thing when it comes to taking care of those in poverty. They do some things, and there are a lot of great NGOs doing good things. But in the land of equal opportunity, the government has a very important role in doing what the private sector cannot or will not do.

Are market forces going to insure children living in poverty? Or does government have to do that? Helping children living in poverty does not create poverty. It just gets medicine to kids would wouldn’t otherwise get it.

I think Bush has demonstrated repeatedly that he is a man without principle. Now is the saddest time of all — when he could be doing unifying things he instead is a far-Right lapdog to the end. I think Bush will prove to be an embarrassment in the history books.

Bush noble?

13 thoughts on “Bush noble?

  1. micadelic says:

    Basically what I am saying is I want the biggest, baddest, most widely projected military force on the planet. Let’s put a laser beam on the fucking moon if we can because that is the ultimate high ground. I want to have this not because I want to use it, but precisely because I don’t want to use it. The USA has it’s faults but it the most benevolent superpower that has ever existed on the face of the planet and we are the greatest force for good the world has ever known. Are we perfect? Far from it. But I’ll take us above anyone else on that list any day. If we let the power slip away, one of the above will grab it and if that happens, the world and all the people in it will be much, much worse off.

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  2. bsherwood says:

    You left Canada out of the mix?
    I think I ordered Number 4 at an Iranian restaurant last time I was in NY

    I understand your point…
    My Dad is a Korean War Vet and he always sad “no matter what we don’t ever want to fight the Chinese”

    long way around saying yes the US should be the superpower. I would hope that with that we can learn something from history. I would also hope that the US take the “high-ground” on human rights/detainment/torture…

    also

    …USSR spending itself into catastrophe…
    the irrational fear of communism.

    the continued expectation that someone will fight us in a conventional way….etc…..

    many a great nation falls from within.

    I listen to friends in Germany, Canada, Norway…What “we” think we are is not what the world thinks we are. What we are fed about the US role is not what they are fed. So someone is getting lied to and being fed a shitload of propaganda….segue to different rant…don’t take away my liberty and tell me it is for Freedom…

    We know other governments lie to the people…why do you think yours doesn’t?

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  3. micadelic says:

    Let me ask you a simple question. Who would you prefer be the dominant superpower in the world? You have to choose one because there will always be at least one, a power vacuum will always be filled. Here are your choices…

    The United States
    Russia
    China
    A Pan-Arab Islamic Caliphate

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  4. bsherwood says:

    lets deal with your first statement of having a base in the middle east…you said like in Germany, Korea etc…

    That is all well and good until you deal with radical muslims or even just the conservative muslims…. There is talk that the bases in Saudi are not “on firm ground” politically….

    As for your other statements…I really, really hope you are correct. It would be excellent if that can actually happen…personally I think you have swallowed the establishments kool-aide of happiness….time will address that argument in due time.

    We agree on McCain.

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  5. micadelic says:

    Yes. Just like we have “left” Japan, and we’ve “left” Germany and we’ve “left” South Korea and we’ve “left” Turkey.

    Hopefully we will have a presence in Iraq such as a couple of well-placed military bases for the foreseeable future. This is a good thing.

    We, contrary to the idiotic views of the left, are not determined to be an occupying force. Would you say we are “occupying” Germany, or Japan, or the other places I list above. We are not fighting against Iraq, we are on the vast majority of the Iraqi people’s side. We are fighting FOR Iraq. More and more people every day are turning against the insurgents, the dead-enders, and the foreign fighters. The good people in Iraq are realizing that we are their friends, their liberators, their protectors because guess what, we actually do want them to be free. We don’t have imperial ambitions in Iraq. We want them to be a free, autonomous Democracy (or at least something closer to a Democracy than a Theocracy or a Dictatorship). You have to realize that this is true.

    And is it about the oil? Of course it is. But more importantly, it’s about who profits from the oil, where do we want the revenues to go? Doe they go to a despotic madman who slaughters his own people and who uses the profits to pursue WMD, nuclear weapons, and sponsor worldwide terror, or do those profits go to a stable government that uses the money to build it’s infrastructure, create businesses, trade with the rest of the world and provide for the common good of the populace?

    This is what we have been fighting about and I’m damn proud of it. Bush is inept because he followed Rumsfeld’s doomed and retarded strategy and kept with it way too long. I agree with McCain on this, McCain was right all along and now that we are following the strategy that he advocated all along, we’re winning, and I propose, we’ve actually won. It’s all over but the crying right now.

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  6. micadelic says:

    We have all but won in Iraq (it’s really over in case you haven’t noticed. just mop-up at this point), we have liberated 50,000,000 plus people in Iraq and Afghanistan from absolute tyranny and we have shined a beacon of hope ion the middle-east for all those oppressed people in Iran, Syria and elsewhere.

    That’s a pretty fucking good start.

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  7. bsherwood says:

    I am sort of jumping in on another thought.

    Yesterday Mr. Bush tried to usurp the Texas Supreme court on a ruling of a death row citizen. I only caught the comments by the Atty General of the state of Texas that used words like “massive abuse of power” and ” complete lack of understanding of State National and international Law”.

    I do agree with Mic’s statement “his motives are noble, at least to him”.

    We are not torturing because we re-defined the word.
    We are “fighting terrorists abroad so that we don’t have to fight them here” this is true because we “say” it is true.(we fight this insane war while our borders to the north and south are a complete joke)

    There were WMD’s
    We are liberating Iraq
    There are WMD’s in Iran

    I believe Mr Bush truly does believe all of this. (which makes him all the more scary)
    I also believe he surrounds himself with lap-dogs and Yes-Men… He is a very dangerous person. This is a very secret and dangerous administration.
    Lots of bad things have happened. Some he has made worse, some he has caused, some of the bad things were dealt to us…

    After 911 what did he say?

    He said; “go shopping, take a trip, spend some money”

    The quotes of insanity go on and on and on….
    The actions of insanity go on and on and on…

    I have a very good friend who is a rabid ultra right human. We argue all the time…and still remain friends…
    When GW was elected and had control of WH,Senate and the House…we both agreed… “ok, now lets set the republican agenda into motion…nothing is stopping the republicans from making their ‘dream’ come true”
    that was 6.5 years ago….what bad things have happened, what good things have happened.

    466 days and 14 hours remain

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  8. micadelic says:

    No, no, no, no. (that’s one more no than you had) When I was a younger man I listened to a really cool radio station (WEBN – it’s not cool any more) in Cincinnati. They ran fake commercials for a fake company called “Brute Force Cybernetics” and the tag line was always “We create a need and then we fill it.” This is what the left has done, they have created a need to for the giant nanny state tit which they are all too happy to fill.

    The left and their programs create poverty by replacing fathers with the government. Hence the explosion in single parent, mother only “families.” (Not too mention the filling up of our prisons with young, mostly black men, who have no roll models, no morlals, who are un-educated, pissed off, and violent.) I lay these problems directly at the feet of all those who think like you. I can’t put charts and graphs in your blog but take a look…

    http://www.neoperspectives.com/summary.htm

    Notice how much poverty and welfare case loads DECLINED since the welfare reforms of the mid 90s which were a direct result of the Republican revolution led by a great American, Newt Gingrich. Welfare reform works, we need more of it.

    Please read the data on this page, you might actually learn something. It’s from an independant study, includes actual census bureau data, and is not right-wing propoganda.

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  9. The right believes that given the chance, and the right kind of help, and the right incentives and not just a handout that these folks can work their way out of poverty. The left believes they are incapable of succeeding and must be continuously taken care of by the ever expanding system.

    No, no, no. The left recognizes FUCKING REALITY that there ARE IN FACT PEOPLE IN POVERTY RIGHT NOW TODAY. While you fuck around trying to create incentives, people, millions of them, have no health insurance because it is too expensive. That is a fact on the ground. I agree with you 100% that we need an anti-poverty agenda. The right talks all sort of bullcrap like that above, but they are not allies in the war against poverty. They are focused on a war against welfare and it’s not getting the job done. Trickle down economics does not work.

    I think the government should, in fact, be in the business of paying people’s health insurance premiums. That’s a whole ‘nother thread.

    And I’ll remind you that there are a hell of a lot of poor white people in the US, too. The racial issue you are trying to bring up is fallacious and you know it.

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  10. micadelic says:

    Are market forces going to insure children living in poverty? Or does government have to do that? Helping children living in poverty does not create poverty. It just gets medicine to kids would wouldn’t otherwise get it.

    No Michael, and you’re being disingenuous and obtuse and you know it. Helping children in poverty does not create poverty and that’s just a retarded, dishonest, hyperbolic statement. “Helping” generation after generation of poor people by just giving them a handout and replacing the father with the government creates an entire class of people that are fucking enslaved by the system. They need a hand up, not a hand out. They need incentive to get out of their situations and they can do it. The left is more racist than the right because they don’t believe black and brown people can succeed without a monstrous government nanny to help them. Liberals either must believe that or they actually are trying to keep these people down so they are dependent on the government handout and keep voting Democrat to keep the plantation running. This argument is a hard, stark dividing line between left and right. The right believes that given the chance, and the right kind of help, and the right incentives and not just a handout that these folks can work their way out of poverty. The left believes they are incapable of succeeding and must be continuously taken care of by the ever expanding system. Which view is more destructive and cynical? The right also believes that truly needy people should be helped and that creating these huge expanding bureaucracies to cover more and more people with higher and higher incomes you are actually taking funds away from the people who really need the help the most. The median income for a family of 4 in this country is about $50,000.00/yr. So the Dems want to expand this program so it covers about half the fucking people in the country. The US Government should not be providing health insurance for half the fucking population, but it should be taking care of the much, much smaller percentage of the population that actually needs it.

    That’s why the left hates people like Clarence Thomas, he is proof that a poor black kid can break out of the cycle of poverty through hard work, character, and determination. They can’t stand it and they try to destroy him. How come there are more women, blacks, and Hispanics in high offices and cabinet positions in Republican administrations than in Democrat administrations? Weird.

    As I’ve said before, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt, I’ll ascribe noble motives to the left for wanting to do this instead of the more evil possibilities such as buying votes, and having a good base to build their socialist society on. What I am saying is you guys are misguided and the way you are going about “helping” people is actually hurting them.

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  11. micadelic says:

    Yes, I believe it. Is he inept, sometimes, he pisses me off quite a bit with his ineptitude. But he’s just a man, and he’s just a man doing what he thinks is right. To ascribe all these evil motives to him and say he wants to fuck the children is just ignorant in my opinion.

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